"Faith" & gurmat

someone said

Faith is a state of openness or trust. To have faith is to trust yourself to the water. When you swim you don't grab hold of the water, because if you do you will sink and drown. Instead you relax, and float. And the attitude of faith is the very opposite of clinging to belief, of holding on.

But I have some reservations on this topic , it is this topic exactly that makes sikhi unique .When people say they have faith ,and not belief , their basic premise is wrong : what they mean to say is
I have faith (open belief) on something ( god, guru etc.) but dont know why .
Hence their faith is actually a belief . And belief without knowledge in any case is "blind". ( but YES when we say Faith is a state of openness or trust. To have faith is to trust yourself to the water.When you swim you don't grab hold of the water----- it is moving towards the concept of "naam" but still not exactly naam)

Guru sahib takes us out of this game of faith instead he has given us the cocept of gyan & bhao .
man samjhaavan kaarnay kachhoo-ak parhee-ai gi-aan. ||5||

When we enter into the world of the guru the process is very simple ::
1) get the infinitesimally simple yet copletely omnipotent giyan from the guru , which leads to : 2) "bhaow" "naam" "prem" for the vaheguru in every thing and activity we do .

Hence the english word faith is inadequate to quench the thirst of gurmukhs. Because faith is always blind but it is only through guru's gyian that the darkness is dispelled and the seed of "naam" is sown.

bhul chuk maaf


Anonymous said…
I didnot start to trust the Guru after reading his Bani.... I had faith in him since I was little and didnot know how to read... To have faith one need no explanation or proof. On the contrary, when you need any explanation or proof, there can be no faith.... It can be trust for mutual gains.

FAITH comes from with in (what you call as blind)... The comment someone wrote you being missionary is so true. You sound so much like Ghagga... What you call blind faith is only thing that helped "Dhanna Jat" to meet the Thakur, "The Supreme"....

You really are a Niyara Khalsa...
Niyara Khalsa said…
Anonomous ji (please write you name , why hide and from whoom ) :

ARE we sikhs of Bani or sikhs of some story teller . SOmeone attached the story of stone to dhan ji and we forgot that the true story of dhanna ji is mentioned in gubani itself and has clearly mentioned that it was not blind fath but complete gyan about other bhagats that led dhanna ji to "naam "::

Page 487

mehulaa 5
Fifth Mehl:

gobindh gobindh gobindh sung naamudhaeo mun leenaa
Naam Dayv's mind was absorbed into God, Gobind, Gobind, Gobind.

aat dhaam ko sheepuro hoeiou laakheenaa
The calico-printer, worth half a shell, became worth millions. ||1||Pause||

bununaa thununaa thiaag kai preeth churun kubeeraa
Abandoning weaving and stretching thread, Kabeer enshrined love for the Lord's lotus feet.

neech kulaa jolaahuraa bhaeiou guneey geheeraa
A weaver from a lowly family, he became an ocean of excellence. ||1||

ravidhaas tuvunthaa tor neeth thin thiaagee maaeiaa
Ravi Daas, who used to carry dead cows every day, renounced the world of Maya.

purugutt hoaa saadhusung har dhurusun paaeiaa
He became famous in the Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy, and obtained the Blessed Vision of the Lord's Darshan. ||2||

sain naaee buthukaareeaa ouhu ghar ghar suniaa
Sain, the barber, the village drudge, became famous in each and every house.

hirudhae vasiaa paarubrehum bhuguthaa mehi ganiaa
The Supreme Lord God dwelled in his heart, and he was counted among the devotees. ||3||

eih bidh sun kai jaatturo outh bhuguthee laagaa
Hearing this, Dhanna the Jaat applied himself to devotional worship.

milae pruthakh gusaaeeaa dhunnaa vuddubhaagaa
The Lord of the Universe met him personally; Dhanna was so very blessed. ||4||2||

p.s. Niyara Khalsa is not an adjective for my name - it is about the Niyara Khalsa Panth - Unique Khalsa Way , this is a extrmely small effort in highlighting the uniqueness.
Niyara Khalsa said…
also , as I understood from your point anonymous ji .

Faith is not wrong ... but it is nothing in comarison to the gurmat path of "naam" .

Initially someone may have faith (as in ur & my case ) or he/she may not have faith but once they are touched by the "paras" of gur updesh (bani) they are attracted to the magnet of "naam" .

this is what I want to highlight , other religions stand on this concept of faith alone ! But sikhi is so unique that it dous not need this support !
Anonymous said…
The above link has parts 1, 2, 3, 5 & 6 only for part 4 click here
Niyara Khalsa said…
anonomous ji ,

why dont you ever write your name ? please use atlest use some fictitios name , so that one is aware is it the same anononomous or a new one !

What has the discussin between Inder Singh & Kulbir singh to do with this post ?
Anonymous said…
Nothing to do with this post, but FYI for the pro Ghagga people....
Sifar said…
Who says Ghagga's debate has nothing to do with this article. Faith is of no importance, but Gyan is the only thing that connects you to the Guru... This is how Ghagga writes. This thinking is on the same track as Ghagga. The debate video is directly linked to this post.....

If an illitrate has faith in the Guru then Guru can get that illitrate to recite the Gita from his mouth or provide him with any "Gyan".

Also reader, please read Niyara Khalsa jee's this post on Guru Granth jee Manyo, Pragat Guran kee Deh in which Niyara Khalsa jee contradicts his own statement....
Niyara Khalsa said…
sifar ji

could you please point out what is the contradiction ?
Sifar said…
Looks like you haven't read my comment to your post "Pargat Guran Ke Deh...". Please do read it and then let me know if you still cannot find where you are contradicting yourself....
Niyara Khalsa said…
yes sifar ji sorry for not correcting my mistake , I should have used ank or panna no.

still if we have created the convention of saying agn. we should understand that these angs are not like human angs ..their needs are diffrent ...their material is diffrent...their way of upkeep is diffrent ! just like my Guru Amar Das (very old- ate mainly khichadi) ji's food needs were very diffrent from Guru Ram das ( Young man ) .
anyways these are futile topics... and u can keep on arguing with a stupid fool like me. Hope guru shib gives us all the right sojhi...
Sifar said…
Great. At least you admitted. I also know that these are not Human Angs, but our Guru's Angs. When ever I get Darshan of our SatGuru Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Granth Sahib jee Maharaaj, I feel like I met Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Nanak Dev Sahib jee Maharaaj and I do not seen any difference between both.

But like Ghagga, you also keep going round and round and provide irrelavent logic. I am a bigger Moorakh than you may be and also I have no or very little knowledge of Bani (but I have full Faith in my SatGuru). Hope one day you also have a debate with someone like Bhai Kulbir Singh jee who debated with Ghagga (and Ghagga kept drinking a lot of water during that debate as seen in the video)...
Anonymous said…
Sifar ji

Interesting facts. I thought I was alone opposing this real Niyara Khalsa....